Heroquest Kickstarter Suspended Over IP Dispute

Heroquest on Kickstarter

I suppose this particular Kickstarter had it coming. The Heroquest 25th Anniversary Kickstarter has been suspended due to an IP dispute. The Kickstarter-project-page just shows a blank.

Heroquest 25th Anniversary is the subject of an intellectual property dispute and is currently unavailable.


#1 – Heroquest IP troubles

A lot of people had high hopes for this Kickstarter, and it certainly hit all the right nostalgia buttons, making some 300.000 Canadian Dollars on the first day alone.

However,when the Kickstarter went live, the FAQ included an odd statement that the company behind the relaunch – Gamezone Miniatures – held the rights for the Heroquest brand only in Spain. An odd proposition at the best of times. It is now at least being disputed.

Whether Games Workshop or Hasbro (now the owners of Milton Bradly Company, or MB Games) fired the shots isn’t really clear (to me at least). A company called Moon Design apparently did!

Moon Design Acquires Glorantha Rights

ANN ARBOR, MICHIGAN – The legendary game world of Glorantha has been transferred to Moon Design Publications. This world has spawned outstanding games for 40 years and is one of the best-known and best-loved places for games and gamers. The roleplaying games of RuneQuest, with over 50 outstanding supplements, and HeroQuest, as well as boardgames and a computer game, have entertained and challenged gamers for a generation. As of August 12th, 2013 Greg Stafford has transferred ownership, creative control and all related intellectual properties to Moon Design Publications.


#2 – Thoughts

To me, there has rarely been a more obvious example on the power of brand-names in miniature wargaming. There is (I believe) no way in hell an “unbranded” dungeon-crawling miniatures game, no matter how good, would’ve made 300.000 Dollars on day one as Heroquest did.

The nostalgia-pull, obviously, was very powerful.

On the other hand, the fragile construct was clearly easy to shoot down, even if Gameszone were to come out on top in the end. The brand/company, at least in this combination, is arguably tarnished from this point forward.

Did Gamezone deserve to have their Heroquest Kickstarter shot down (as far as “suspended” will likely mean it’s over)?

Leave a comment and let me know what you think!

Z.

Official GameZone Miniatures Update:

Please bear with us. Gamezone and Moon Design are in a meeting negotiating a settlement for both parts at this time.Moon Design believes that their interests in the HEROQUEST brand within the USA will be infringed upon. Although we are not distributing or selling our product in US territory. As a precaution Moon Design presented a C/D on the 27th of Nov. Our talks are coming to a point where the negotiation will benefit all those involved, which finally would let us offer our product in stores in the USA sometime next year.

The Moon Design C/D was suspended, but on the table, as another element in the negotiation. Here at Gamezone it is our hopeful understand that its activation is possibly by error as both parties where coming to an agreement. Said agreement would finally end beneficially for Fans in the USA by opening the physical distribution to stores in that country. This brief pause of activity is as harmful to the interests of Moon Design as it is to Gamezone Miniatures.

We are as surprised as the Heroquest community, we didn’t expect that on Thanksgiving, of all days, to be wrapped up in this mess, that is so disagreeable for everyone involved. On a day such as this it is extremely complicated to get in touch with Moon Design. We are working diligently on a solution so we can continue with the project from where it is at the moment and reinforce it for the future.

Thank you. Dionisio

Source: http://www.fancueva.com/ludico/comunicado-oficial-de-gamezone-sobre-el-bloqueo-de-heroquest-25-aniversario/


Official Update from Moon Design

We want to give some background on the dispute surrounding Gamezone’s Kickstarter campaign to launch a remake of the hybrid board game/roleplaying game originally published by Milton Bradley called “Heroquest”.Last week, Moon Design petitioned Kickstarter to remove the crowdfunding campaign for Gamezone’s “Heroquest” game. “Heroquest” is the registered US trademark of Moon Design and is the name of our “Heroquest” roleplaying game and assorted products. To allow a game using the same name to be promoted in the United States through Kickstarter without a license would be an unacceptable dilution of our brand and create market confusion to our detriment.

The trademark “Heroquest” is registered by Francis Greg Stafford with the United States Patent and Trademark Office (Registration Number 4082281) for use in game book manuals. Moon Design Publications LLC has the exclusive license for use of that trademark. For some time now we have been working on creating a board game called “Heroquest” pertaining to the mythology of Glorantha and an updated version of our Heroquest roleplaying game.

The project by Gamezone, a Spanish game company, proposes to remake a role-playing/board game originally produced by Milton Bradley and Games Workshop in 1989. The project calls their game “Heroquest” which is identical to our registered mark and easily confused with it.

Gamezone initially asked us for use of the Heroquest trademark on July 31, 2013. The next day we asked them if they could provide us with a copy of any written agreement with Hasbro to produce a 25th Anniversary Edition of Hasbro’s board game. Gamezone did not provide us with any written confirmation (and as of this date still has not done so). On August 26, 2013, we informed Gamezone by email that we must decline their request.

Despite being explicitly refused permission to use our trademark, Gamezone went ahead and launched this Kickstarter. As a New York State corporation, Kickstarter is subject to US trademark laws and the use of our trademark in the campaign was a violation of those laws.We told Gamezone that they needed to immediately get a licensing agreement from us (which, among other things, would require that they pay us for the rights to the name since it would mean foregoing our opportunity to release our game using our trademark and to compensate us for that lost revenue).

Gamezone did not get back to us within the period we set, and rather than have this end up in litigation (which could also bring in other parties with IP at stake), we asked Kickstarter to suspend the campaign. We then spoke to Gamezone informing them that we had certain non-negotiable demands for any license agreement, among them a statement that Gamezone has explicit permission from Hasbro to make this game based on their IP. Gamezone has assured us that they can get such permission, but until we see confirmation, we cannot responsibly license our trademark to be used in this Kickstarter campaign.

We sympathize with the fans of the Milton Bradley game who enthusiastically supported this project. We strongly support Kickstarter and the revitalization of old games with a loyal following. However, such activities must be done with the consent of the trademark holder and of any other legal owners of the property.

Source: http://www.glorantha.com/background-concerning-suspension-of-gamezones-kickstarter-campaign/

Update December 8th 2013

It appears that Gamezone Miniatures attempted a new launch of their Heroquest project on the Spanish crowd-funding platform Verkami, only to have the new project suspended within hours.

Dear backers,

We want to comunicate our decision of stoping the campaign were you had pledged: ‘Heroquest 25th Anniversary’

The urge to publish the project by the authors today sunday 8 at 1 am has precipitated it’s publication without being able, the team of verkami, to spend the right time to review the project.

After carefully studying the campaign, we believe that the content of the project could be misleading to our users.

Your pledges will be cancelled so no charges will be made in your card or PayPal account.

We thank you for your trust, and we want to apologize for any inconvenience our handling of the project might have caused.

Verkami team

Zweischneid

Zweischneid

I am Zweischneid. Wargame Addict. Hopeless painter and founder of Pins of War. I hope you enjoyed this article. Don't forget to share your favourite miniature pictures and wargaming videos at www.pinsofwar.net.
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  • HQFan

    Pretty clear what happened: Hasbro/GW had no intention of doing anything with the IP but now that they have seen how much potential it has they are going to kill the project that has already done all the work and do a re-release of their own. Classic big business bullying, expect a Hasbro/GW announcement in the next month or so.

    • Leo

      Yeah. Pretty clear….lol

    • Jonas Schiött

      Except that is in no way what’s happened.

  • belverker

    if they truely didn’t have the rights for a global release they wereplaying with fire, people think gw are bad with their ip protection, they have nothing on hasbro…

    • http://pinsofwar.net/ Zweischneid

      Apparently neither Hasbro or GW, but a company called “Moon Design”.

      Looks like a big mess either way

      • belverker

        saw that on your facebook page, interesting

  • Barbarian

    It was implied during the radio interview yesterday that Heroquest’s American trademark is owned by some other, unnamed party. Not Hasbro or GW. So could be someone else that raised the dispute.

    I think the massive amount of money this kickstarter raised also raised a lot of eyebrows. Its a shame because fans of this game have been pining for a new edition for years and nobody listened. If nothing else, at least Gamezone has proven the market potential for Heroquest.

    • http://pinsofwar.net/ Zweischneid

      It appears to be “moon design” who published a Heroquest (RPG?) book with Cubicle 7

      • Laz

        Roleplaying game set in Glorantha. Absolutely nothing to do with this IP, although technically trademarks may have been involved.

        • http://pinsofwar.net/ Zweischneid

          They registered the trademark “heroquest” with the keyword “game”. I don’t think the IP registration system breaks it down quite so fine as “board game with RPG background” and “RPG with possibly miniatures”.

          Either way, a judge making such a fine distinction would probably open floodgates in a million other places.

          • Haystack

            Strictly speaking Moon Design’s trademark is for “Role playing
            game equipment in the nature of game book manuals.” However, it seems unlikely that Gamezone would be able to word their manual without some reference to the trademark so…

            To say nothing of the fact that Moon Design could easily file for a more comprehensive trademark.

  • Badgerboy1977

    I’m sorry but this had disaster written all over it from the start.

    I’d love to see a Heroquest game but you can’t just appropriate the name without acquiring the rights and giving the originators their dues.

  • spiritofmonkey

    While IP holders are due their pound of flesh, these guys have done nothing for years with the IP. If Moon Design (or Hasbro if it’s just a shell company) get greedy, I hope Gamezone use this as free publicity to do a relaunch with all HQ IP removed, but similar boardgame and laugh all the way to the bank and leave the IP trolls with zip.

    • Vaughan Cockell

      Just had to clarify – Moon Design have never had a connection to the Boardgame. What they hold is the rights to the name “HeroQuest” and have a current Roleplaying game out and in print, and supported with supplements for that game. So to say tyhey have done nothing with the IP for years is not exactly true.

      • Glen

        So why complain? You can copyright a name, hero quest is so generic anyway… Lots of games have the same name… Bloody stupid, another case of OIA stupidity (Only in America for those not in the know)

        • Vaughan Cockell

          See Jonas Schott’s post above for a neat history of the name. The board game might be generic fantasy, the RPG, and the name’s concept in it’s core setting is definitely not “so generic”.

          • Glen

            This Heroquest isn’t a RPG, the rules have been free online for years, heck ill go and scan them plus all the expansions now if you like I have it in my room, the rules ar not that different to space crusade, or the old ok that’s my leg, goblins in the pantry, 2000 AD, road wars, etc that games workshop released back in the day…

            From what I’ve read this is just a case of, my games called Heroquest, you can’t use the name… Even if it’s not written the same… You could argue it’s a fantasy setting, but unless every company if going to pay Cornwall for the use of its myths and legends then I’m sure the UK economy will appreciate it hehe…

            Just call the game Hero-Quest or HerosQuest and tell the lawyers to get off home… All this irratates me as you can’t copyright goblins and orks etc and nobody cares what the names of charecters / places in a boardgames are anyway so just rename them.

            Oh well I’m sure it will all work out in the end ;)

          • Vaughan Cockell

            Oh yes, change the name and the problem would go away. Of course, it wouldn’t be a 25th anniversary edition then, just a game inspired by Heroquest, of which there are many. Looking over Moon Design’s statement, their initial requirements seem quite enabling: essentially, “Be sure you have full permission for the Game, and we’ll allow you to use the name.” As their progenitor, Greg Stafford spent years reclaiming his IP they are in a good position to appreciate its minefields. Its only after Gamezone ignored them and went ahead did they get tough. Even now it looks like they are still willing to work a deal, as long as rights to the GAME are clearly dealt with.

          • Glen

            Why wouldn’t it, it’s the rules that make a game not its name, they could call it Anniversary Quest: A update to Heroquest, as long as the core game mechanics are the same… (Hopefully to the UK version, the USA rules used by online versions of the game are rubbish)

            Also look at Runequest, it rerelease a under the name hero wars in 2000 and then Heroquest in 2003, so your saying they are all different games… So Heroquest was the boardgames first surely?

            But your right, it would have been better if Hasbro UK had released the 25 anniversary edition, everyone was excited when they renewed their IP for the name Heroquest till 2015, but I imagine if they had a game in the works they would have put in their own cease and disist notice… Hopefully they are watching the news and how much it is worth and games workshop and Hasbro UK will rerelease Heroquest and Space crusade in the next year or so (fingers crossed)

          • Vaughan Cockell

            Hasbro could indeed release Anniversary Quest, that would be cool, or Games Workshop could release Warhammer Quest, possibly including a “Basic Game” within it if they got the rights to the board game design from Hasbro – that’s my preferred solution, personally.

            Re RuneQuest and HeroQuest, they are actually completely different rules sets, HeroQuest being a “narrative” rpg that is able to manage broad scales of power, from simple tribesman to Great Gods in a way RuneQuest never could/can. Both are trademarks of Moon Design, along with the fanatsy setting of Glorantha. As has been said, while the boardgame was the first actually trademarked, Heroquest was promised as a supplement/companion game to Runequest back in its second edition. If I was at home I could scan in the page of the rulebook where it was mentioned, as evidence. So “who had it first” is, from a certain point of view, a bone of contention also.

            I also heard from another forum, that Gamezone have acquired the Spanish rights (again, only Spanish) to “Space Crusade” also, so it seems they think they have found an exploitable loophole to international IP conventions. I fear this could become very ugly for the whole Kickstarter approach if all parties are not careful…

          • http://pinsofwar.net/ Zweischneid

            Dunno. It’s also worth noting that by Moon Design’s own statements (quotes):

            1.) Gamezone initially asked us for use of the Heroquest trademark on July 31, 2013.
            2.) As of August 12th, 2013 Greg Stafford has transferred ownership, creative control and all related intellectual properties to Moon Design Publications.
            3.) On August 26, 2013, we informed Gamezone by email that we must decline their request.

            I might be paranoid, but something about the sequence of event strikes me wrong. There’s things we don’t know yet, I would believe.

          • Haystack

            Moon Design had an elusive license to the Heroquest trademark well before they bought the IP. Besides, are you suggesting that Greg Stafford would sell off an entire lifetime of work just so that Moon Design could profit off some shady license squeeze?

          • http://pinsofwar.net/ Zweischneid

            I am suggesting that neither side is telling the whole story. That is all.

            If it is his “lifetime of work”, why did he make this transfer, of all times, within those 26 days?

          • Haystack

            It’s a coincidence. The timing was because Moon Design was in the process of hyping up the upcoming Guide to Glorantha, and because Gencon happens in August.

            The reason Greg transferred the rights in the first place is because he’s getting
            up there in the years (the man is a contemporary with Gygax to put it in
            context for you). He’s know some of the people in Moon Design for decades and
            had worked successfully with the company for the better part of a decade. They’re
            the successors to his legacy.

          • http://pinsofwar.net/ Zweischneid

            Well, it’s a very, very, very, very unfortunate coincidence, if it is one. He should go on record and clarify it.

            Where have they stated those things? Or are you simply assuming the best from MD (and the worst from GZ) in all things?

            Doesn’t sound like a neutral approach to me.

          • Haystack

            They talk about it in the first few minutes of their talk at gencon: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIXmD9ILgHA. Lots of talk about Greg’s legacy and securing their place in expanding Glorantha’s future. Glorantha is their passion and career.

            In any case, what are you implying, specifically? In what way could MD be the bad actor in this setup? At the very worst they were being aggressive about protecting their IP which is A) legal and B) fair on the grounds that they have an extensive library of published work reaching back decades.

            Since you asked, my assumption regarding GZ is that they are some normal creative types that didn’t do their due diligence on the legal front. Anything beyond that would be pure speculation on my part.

          • http://pinsofwar.net/ Zweischneid

            Thanks for the video.

            As said, I am not implying anything. Quite the opposite. I am trying to avoid jumping to conclusions, negative or positive, towards either of the two parties involved, at least not until all questions were answered.

            The timing in MD’s transfer look odd (just as lots of communications from GZ look odd). Your info certainly helped clear a lot of it.

            Still, you should avoid painting people into a “if you’re not with us, you must be against us” corner.

            Again, I am trying to make myself a picture of a company I knew nothing about 3 days ago. I am not jumping to any conclusions or making any implications, including the conclusion/implication that MD (or GZ) are simply innocent as virgin snow.

          • Glen

            So technically they didn’t name anything hero quest first, if writing on paper were IP then I’m sure Heroquest was taken long before that somewhere, also for example Flintloque promised a WW2 rule set, but I can’t remember what it was to be called, it’ll be in a draw somewhere…. In my opinion the name is Hasbros or really Steve Bakers as he was the first to write and release a game with the title.

            It reminds me of when McDonalds tried to sue McDonalds in Scotland for IP infringement and the judge said no, I think Americans expect IP to mean something over common sense.

            I think if this happened in England the judge would say, Heroquest is a generic fantasy name, the game already exists so is not a new property, so if it’s ok with the creators then who’s it hurting, then it would be thrown out of court.

            Lets just hope that the rest of the world doesn’t become like America, or we will quickly run out of words… We will have titles like ‘A Dungeon Adventure Featuring Four Heros On A Quest To Defeat A Evil Magician Who’s Name Is Mordak’ just so it has a different IP to the next dugeon crawler.

            Hehe makes me think of Munchkin Quest, Heroica and

          • Vaughan Cockell

            No-one denies that Chaosium/Greg Stafford didn’t Trademark “HeroQuest” before Milton Bradley/Games Workshop did, but the fact remains they intended to and invented the verb “to heroquest” in their setting of Glorantha, back in 1980. As has been described, MB games and Games Workshop Trademarked the name for it’s boardgame, and even apologised to Greg Stafford for taking the name, as they were a licensed distributor for the RuneQuest game at the time. Greg legally acquired the Trademark “HeroQuest” back from MB after it lapsed in 2002/2003, releasing a fresh edition of the RPG “Hero Wars” under the name “HeroQuest”.

            What Moon Design, who now hold the rights – transferred from Greg Stafford directly, are saying is that to produce a legitimate HeroQuest boardgame, permission to reproduce the boardgame must be acquired by Gamezone, from the company who holds those rights, namely Hasbro. If that is not done Hasbro could sue all involved parties out of existence for breach of Board Game IP. That’s their condition for license granting of the title, it always was their condition. Gamezone didn’t do this, so they’ve upped the anti by saying they’ll charge for their IP, the name, which is quite reasonable and standard practice, as I understand it.

          • Glen

            I like what Gamezone have put on their site, it seems a well established website, I’m pretty sure the game will go ahead, even if it drops off the radar and is just sold in Spain.

            http://www.gamezoneminiatures.com/tienda/es/

          • Glen

            Sorry I just get cross, Moondesign sell Heroquest RPG in England even though they don’t have the IP, I don’t know the details, maybe they pay Hasbro for the privalage? Also England has it’s own Heroquest LARP RPG system from 1986 set in Orin Rakatha and along with Lorien Trust is one of the best systems I a have experienced, I’m sure there are loads of small publishers with Hero Quest rule sets, it’s such a generic name, alongside dungeonquest and the like…

            I seriously think this is just America, all the mess with Harmony Gold a few years ago and now this, it’s like companies are not interested in making products, just sitting on IP till they can sue someone else… And by companies I mean Americans…

            Anyway having a moan doesn’t change anything, I just find the arguments ridiculous.

  • Glen

    Well dang, I was really looking forward to this and would have supported it more as time went on, I have the Space Hulk 20th anniversary game, and hero quest swad so much better, I still have the original to play so even if they separated all the scenery and sold it separately I’d happily buy it… Hope they just rebrand their game now, none of the components are subject to copyright, all the charecters and monsters are generic and the rules are free all over the Internet so no need to publish them… It’s a bloody stupid IP to own to be honest… Really cross

  • Jonas Schiött

    For those who don’t know the history of this.
    Way back in the early days of RPGs, Chaosium – the company then publishing the game RuneQuest – announced that there was an upcoming expansion that would be called HeroQuest, since it involved the characters gaining the power of legendary heroes. But as most RPG companies back then were not very business savvy, they neglected to trademark the names of their upcoming products. So Games Workshop said “hey that’s a cool name, we’ll slap that on our new boardgames and get the trademark”. The Chaosium guys were not happy, they felt their name had been stolen.
    Many years later an RPG that fulfilled the original promise of HeroQuest was published, but they had to call it Hero Wars instead. But when the time came for a second edition of Hero Wars, they realized that GW had let the trademark lapse. So they stole it back. ;)

    • Y4kvirus

      “Moon Design” has open forums, seems like they need a little love for their patent Trolling. And if it wasn’t trolling there would have been an issue before they saw how well the KickStarter was doing. Sounds like GameZone had an agreement and those little s#$ts wanted a bigger chunk of the pie.

      • Jonas Schiött

        They have a forum, so… what? You want to go post some rants there because you think they did something wrong? That would make YOU the troll.

        In fact, the rest of your comments are just pure speculation and name-calling, so I guess it’s true. Typical troll behaviour.

      • http://pinsofwar.net/ Zweischneid

        Yeah. Don’t troll their forums. The people doing the Moderation there aren’t the ones calling the shots either, I would think.

        But I agree that an official Moon Design Statement would be welcome.

    • Glen

      Sorry your wrong, it was invented in 1990 by MB games notably Steve Baker who “is a game designer that tried so hard to get fantasy games published by a major company. In the 90′s was a staff member at Milton Bradley UK. His heart was never in family games, he always wanted to push boundaries. Heroquest was his idea and he single-handedly persuaded MB to produce it. They did, and sales were much better than expected. So Steve used this opportunity to make them take interest in a similar game, Space Crusade. But Steve wasn’t terribly happy and the last I saw of him, he was emigrating to America. I have completely lost contact but it would be good to renew old acquaintances. I have to thank Steve because Heroquest opened the doors to other companies, from which I benefitted.” MB were bought out by Habro UK and will own the rights to Heroquest till 2015.

      The other Heroquest isn’t as old, only has the rights in America and has nothing to do with Heroquest 25th Anniversary…. Please people get your facts in order… Also just stop selling to America, it’s a legal black hole that’s ruined Battetech and so many other franchises, just leave that market alone…and bring Heroquest home to the UK hehe

      • Glen

        I’ve done a bit more digging and it seems that they have the rights to make Heroquest in Spain and the rights to make amendments from the owners Hasbro, also they are in negotiations with Hasbro UK to release here, so no wonder Hasbro and Games workshop are sitting on the fence as is the American branches disagree then they are fighting themselves in Europe… Hopefully this means that the game will go ahead and be called Heroquest… In Europe anyway, maybe in America it will need a rename, but this happens a lot I’ve noticed with films, books and the odd game. Heroquest was always more popular in Europe anyway.

        http://thewertzone.blogspot.co.uk/2013/11/hero-quest-returns.html

        Will be watching the story as it develops

      • Vaughan Cockell

        You may well be correct over the BOARD GAME CONCEPT and design, but the NAME “HeroQuest” does indeed predate the boardgame, being used as the previous poster said. I understand that when Games Workshop and Milton Bradley trademarked the name GW even rang Greg Stafford to apologise for taking the name out from under him.

  • Haystack

    Moon Design explains their position in detail here: http://www.glorantha.com/background-concerning-suspension-of-gamezones-kickstarter-campaign/

    It sounds perfectly reasonable to me. Not fun, but good business practice on MD’s part. Note that the offer of a license is still on, pending some footwork by Gamezone.

    • http://pinsofwar.net/ Zweischneid

      Thanks. I’ve added it to the post.

  • Guest

    http://yeoldeinn-heroquest.blogspot.co.uk/2012/12/custom-heroquest-tile-base.html http://papermau.blogspot.co.uk/2012/06/hero-quest-style-furniture-for-rpg.html. I think it must be a kick starter thing, so many websites make stuff for Heroquest still… Gamezone did it wrong, they should have done it like Bloodbowl and sold the figures, cards, board, furniture etc separately and just had a living rule book and quests online.

  • Guest

    Tomorrow at this time we will reopen the HQ25th project in a spanish crowfunding platform, Verkami. We decided do this so we own the trademark in Spain and avoid that can’t be attacked in the middle of crowdfunding under any “suspected remote threat.”

    Everything will be as a “period followed” except for two main differences:

    In Verkami, the money given to the project author undertakes to complete the game, and if he didn’t, then he have the obligation to return the money to participants.

    The stretch goals that were already released, will return to gain from a base figure, all of them, you won’t need to unlock them again.

    Email from Gamezone Minitures, so glad it’s going ahead again

    • Vaughan Cockell

      Well I wish them the best of luck, though I still believe they are “skating on thin ice” combining an unofficial tribute version (changing details to avoid copyright infringement) with the original name of the game and would be safer to call it something related but different. Still, that’s their decision.

      Interestingly, Jeff Richard of Moon Design has a similar opinion:
      “Hey,
      if they want to do their unlicensed remake of a MB Game on Verkami,
      that’s not our problem and I’d be perfectly happy to wish them well. As
      for the USPTO, I strongly doubt that the examining attorney will approve
      their application, but we’ll be watching the process.
      That being said, if someone actually had the rights to remake MB Heroquest, we’d have no qualms about licensing the US trademark. Or if Hasbro wanted to do it…”
      From a discussion on Google+

      • Guest

        I wouldn’t worry about that, anyone who is interested in Heroquest can get all the rules free from Hasbro anyway by typing http://www.hasbro.com/common/instruct/heroquest into google, a list of all the various rules and adventures will come up (the link will take you to the rule book) or contact Hasbro and they will eventually send you the PDF files or a link.

        It’s just a new board and cards and scenery fans need to play the game, it would have been better to have sold the bits without rules and put new quests online for people… But never mind.

        I really don’t think Hasbro mind if they are not intending to relaunch the game, Id rather they did, goodness knows games like Risk have been rereleased more times then is necessary.

        I just hope Moon Design is very clear if they release a boardgames, that theirs is not a remake of The classic Heroquest, or I can imagine a lot of dissapointed fans.

        • Vaughan Cockell

          Re Moon Design’s boardgame plans, I agree, and made the same point on their G+ page early in the debacle. They asked if the subject could be avoided at the time, probably because of the amount of extra work and hatemail that was probably flying around at that point. I may make the point again in a couple of months, once the thing has died down.

        • Chris. K Cook

          “, if someone actually had the rights to remake MB Heroquest, we’d have no qualms about licensing the US trademark. Or if Hasbro wanted to do it…”

          Spoken like true filthy Patent Squatters. “Yeah Hasbro you pay us to make your game….”

          “I just hope Moon Design is very clear if they release a boardgames, that theirs is not a remake of The classic Heroquest, or I can imagine a lot of dissapointed fans.”

          They won’t because that what they are banking on…

    • http://pinsofwar.net/ Zweischneid

      Well, at the very least, it’ll make people look at sites other than Kickstarter and Indiegogo

  • Guest

    Looks like GameZone are a bit upset with the situation, they definatly seem to think kickstarter has victimised them. I doubt they will be doing buissnes in the US again, I imagine they will become very protective of their IP in Spain now they own it, anyway read here.

    http://www.heroquestclassic.com/update-about-ks-pause/

    • http://pinsofwar.net/ Zweischneid

      Yes and no. They likely know that Kickstarter won’t unlock it, so they put it in a way as if they’d refuse to work with them. It’s a “you can’t fire me, I quit” kinda response.

      That said, “if I were Kickstarter”, I wouldn’t budge either. They can’t look at individual projects and really need to look out for their reputation. There’re enough frauds as it is (not saying GZ is one of them) on Kickstarter, and if they ever loose that “credibility” and people start seeing Kickstarter.com as a den of shady types, their entire business is likely to suffer.. a lot.

  • Guest
    • http://pinsofwar.net/ Zweischneid

      Yup. Was only up on Verkami for an hour or two before they closed it down.

      • Guest

        Oh well, kept the faith as long as possible, I’ve ordered some replacement bits for my copy of hero quest, lucky to have saved the fae and every add on that was released in the UK so it’s time to print of a charecter sheet from the web and have a nostalgic Christmas, I’m just glad all the annuals have a contents list lol… So nota complete loss… Still I’m kinda sad this died it would have been nice… Oh well 30th Anniversary to look forward to ;)

  • Guest
  • Nick Pruiksma

    Why doesn’t/didn’t Gamezone just produce the game under a different name??? With all the build up to the Kickstarter campaign, we ALL KNEW what the game really was, so who cares if they called it “Heroic Quest”, “Heroic Adventures” or “Quest of Heroes” or whatever???

    I dunno if Gamezone was being stubborn, stupid, naive or any combination of the three. Either way I’m really disappointed this project will likely now never come to fruition. I was pretty excited.

    • Guest

      I think maybe they bought he rights to Heroquest so are a bit annoyed anyone can tell them they can’t use it? Otherwise I think someone in Spain would have sued them by now.

      I think maybe they just didn’t realise they can’t fund through an American Crowdsourcing company, now the bad rep is against them…

      just a guess, till Hasbro Spain or Games Workshop Spain make a statement otherwise, then it really will be dead, just wait and see what happens, buy the game direct from their website if they ever get it off the ground.

  • GW fan UK

    Ok this is just rumour, so take it with a pinch of salt, but I was talking to the manager at the warhammer world store in Nottingham and he says GW is releasing a out of print game every year, the last one was the old Warhammer game with elves and Skaven (Can’t remember what it’s called). He recons that Heroquest will be the next one if they are alternating between limited edition Boardgames/Tabletop games. So I very much doubt that Gamezone will ever be able to release their game. Maybe in Spain if they have the rights, but who wants to buy a know of Heroquest if Games Workshop release a LIMITED edition version of the game next year or in the next few years (The Mangaer also said it could be a different specialist game next year).

    Like I said all just rumours, but the fact is games workshop are releasing out of print games, ill add a list if I can find one.

    • http://pinsofwar.net/ Zweischneid

      Sounds intriguing.

      That said, not being a lawyer, wouldn’t GW face the same IP issues with Heroquest. It’s obviously not (entirely?) theirs anymore.

      Not to mention that it doesn’t tie in with Warhammer.

      If they do it, why would they want to make it “Heroquest” as opposed to, say, “Warhammer Quest”?.

      • GW fan UK

        I am not sure, maybe Advanced Hero Quest is more likely as they own the Ip for that outright, like they did for Space Hulk, like Space Hulk he was saying special edition games are just released over a short time period to get maximum sales then are discontinued again. I understand Hasbro UK own the IP here till 2015 (I’m sure they are making money off of Moon Design just renting the licence at the moment lol) so Gamesworkshop couldn’t do it till after then.

        Maybe Advanced Heroquest is more likely… Ill investigate and ask next time I’m in Notts.

  • Rasmus

    Actually, I am SURE they are not , as they do NOT have a license from Hasbro, at least according to their own legal department.

    • http://pinsofwar.net/ Zweischneid

      Moon Design has no license from Hasbro either. It would seem that Hasbro doesn’t have the rights to it anymore, simple as that.

      Which is the very thing that was odd about Moon Design’s initial response. Why would they refer GameZone to Hasbro and ask them to bring a letter from Hasbro, if Moon Design owns the brand and it was Moon Design that was approached by GameZone?

      Riddles in the dark….

      • Chris. K Cook

        Easy, Moon Design are Patent Squatters. Why else would you make a Game set in Gloriantha ‘Heroquest’ not ‘Runequest’?

        They are trying to trade on Nostalga as much as Game one is. At least the nostalga Gamezone is trying to profit from is real.